Thursday, April 19, 2012

Of ratings and juniors

Eddy Fong wrote a series of posts on ratings and juniors which seemed to have stirred up a lively discussion over at his blog site.

Now I consider Eddy and Tse Pin two of the most knowledgeable people on ratings locally (by the way, Raymond Siew says ratings are irrelevant but do not listen to him, he knows nothing about chess) so I followed the discussion closely without taking part. Later the discussion moved to which group of juniors from 1990s or 2000s were stronger. Many names were mentioned and indeed they are a whos who of juniors from past decades . Mas, Ee Vern, Yee Weng, Zi Jing, Tze Han, Jonathan, Nicholas, Marcus, Ronnie, Anas were some of our best juniors I have seen in my career.

[Start Aside] - Raymond says I have not brought up any strong players. Well, at least two of those names I mentioned were my former students. I leave it up to him to read up our Malaysian history - which he has zero knowledge - to find out who they are. Hmmm, on the other hand , don't bother, I know you are too lazy for that and it makes little difference to me. [End Aside]

Even Rationality got into the act and he has not posted in over a year at his blog. To make him come out of hibernation must be something.

Anyway, what I am trying to say is it is pointless to argue over this. It's like arguing which was our best olympiad  , which by the way is Dubai ;)

'Nuff said!


edfong said...

After we get back from Melaka ok.... Sneaky fella. I say first 11 rounds of Turin, and that's final. haha

Anonymous said...

The best result? Year you won gold medal, lah. Simple! Dubai 1986. No other year compares, until you win gold medal again. Only gold counts, not even GM norm.

Ilham said...

I say Dubai 1986

Simple Comparison

Dubai:42 out of 108
Turin:80 out of 147

Dubai:Elo 2320
Turin:Elo 2393

Dubai:Ng Ek Teong won Gold Medal for 2nd reserve board, scored 6/7 for elo 2510 performance
Dubai:Jimmy won beautifully against IM Yrola, game dubbed among the finest game at this Olympiad

Turin:Mas won against Korchnoi, in 21 moves.
Malaysia won 3.5 out of 4 against Canada, considered to be among best upset ever in ALL Olympiads.

Here and there
Dubai: In last round, i think Jimmy and Peter had a won game against Belgium, both lost.

Turin: In last 2 rounds, Malaysia scores only one point out of 8...

Still...i say Dubai is Malaysia's finest hour at Olympiad

Ilham said...

Sorry Eddy,
To determine best Olympiad, need to take all,good rounds and bad rounds... just like vow before marriage " for better, for worse, for richer, for poorer, in sickness or in health," Tak acilah chose the best only...:)

Good luck to Yit Ho and Yit San in coming MIC...Malacca International Chesslah!

Anonymous said...

Ilham, too many yardsticks mean no conclusive result. If you must have a decision, you must have something to show, like a medal. I think it was NG EK LEONG who won the gold, not his brother Ek Teong.

Nowadays,an Olympic gold medal is the ultimate achievement in most sports, except the "legitimate" World Championship. Of course a reserve medal is not as good as a 1st board medal, but then unless Fischer reincarnaltes as a Malaysian, we don't have much chance, do we?

edfong said...

Thanks, Ilham.

Wahh... you really Dubai supporter. Making all those old men happy only. What has Jimmy and Peter offered you?

Jimmy Liew said...

Walau, you guys really take me seriously ;)

The wink din give me away?

Ilham said...

Hi Anon,
Have recheck. Ng Ek Teong is the one who won the medal.

Hi Eddy,
Sadly they offered me nothing...i am of the opinion that Dubai is Malaysia finest hour for a long time. 2 years ago i wrote an article about it

Hope they could better it in next Olympiad!

Anonymous said...

It is Ng Ek Leong who won the board prize in Dubai Olympiad.

Anonymous said...

Jimmy, you were there. Was it Ek Leong or Ek Teong?

Jimmy Liew said...

It should be Ek Teong.

Jimmy Liew said...

I remember I shared a room with Peter. I remember Muzzafar was pretty much sick after arriving and hardly played. But in all honesty, Ek Teong was so low key, I hardly remember him there.

Peter Long said...

Hi Jimmy,

Your memory is not what it used to be! But of course you were focused winning games for the team! It was Ng Ek Leong (Ek Teong was his older much less stronger brother). In Dubai only Jimmy was playing well among the seniors (including Christie, Francis and myself - Ahmad Muzzafar was a debutant and also sick throughout)so when Ek Leong got good results when fielded against weaker teams I saw there was a chance to get a Gold Medal and so we made the decision to protect him as that meant something for OCM and our standing with the Ministry of Sports.

If I remember correctly we shielded him from the better teams and also gave him as many Whites as possible. I know this because I think at one stage I played six blacks in a row as a result because Christie always wanted White as much as possible and Francis had problems with Black too!

Of course I remember as the brothers Ek Leong and Ek Teong, together with the another set of siblings Audrey Wong and Adrian Wong and including also Gregory Vijayendran and Chan Han Meng were all part of the Kumpulan Remaja (National Junior Squad) which I ran for MCF for the two years leading up to Dubai.

Jimmy Liew said...

"Your memory is not what it used to be!"
No arguments here :)

I was just discussing this with Chin Seng and he was almost certain it was Ek Leong too. But Olimpbase listed Ek Teong instead and I trusted it. Truly, I have no re-collection of Ek Leong being there!

I do remember the golden board had many whites and someone would have to end up with the corresponding blacks!

I also remember I wrote for Lim Chong's column an article "How about an Elite Squad?", the premise being to train and groom a junior squad, and after that you formed the Junior Squad. Unfortunately nobody else seems to remember or acknowledge what you did then.

But today a mad man keeps whacking you and of course me as well.

Peter Long said...

Well, it is MCF who should initiate setting up a junior squad - there are little pieces here and there already such as organising a team for the World U-16 Olympiad whose members were all on merit - and better still in the larger context of a talent development program.
I for one would be open to helping and I am sure many others of a certain playing strength and experience, both past and present, would be willing to contribute in some way. We could certainly get the likes of Li Tian, Roshan, and Najiha' (to name just a few - I know there are many) to a much better level than they would achieve in the same time as they are progressing today.

Anonymous said...

This National Junior squad is more than 25 years back. And since then there has been talent emerging every now and then, but we have never had a concerted effort to form another proper National Junior squad to harness these talents. What are the chances now, with many juniors going their own ways with the various coaches out there. Can we start again with Lim Chong's question "How about another Elite Squad?"

Peter Long said...

Well Anonymous,

I shared duties on the Malay Mail chess pages for many years with Lim Chong and he would have remembered very well its success so I am not surprised if he said that.

My offer is on record - it is up to those who run MCF and they may have their own plans and we have to respect that.

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